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Terry McDermott and Dr. Gary Lynch: How Memories Get Made

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Andrew Atkin Avatar
Andrew Atkin
Posts: 36
Posted: 07.12.11, 06:41 PM
And have you noticed how for all our analysis into the brain we are not one single step closer to understanding how it experiences itself - on any level. All we can see is "the machine".
Andrew Atkin Avatar
Andrew Atkin
Posts: 36
Posted: 07.12.11, 03:00 PM
The idea that a giant clock can experience itself is something we take on faith. So who is being religious?
evilgeenius Avatar
evilgeenius
Posts: 1
Posted: 07.12.11, 06:17 AM
"People with this style of "deep thinking" made themselves a church and brought dark ages."

I completely agree, it's quite depressing to see this religious style of thinking
Andrew Atkin Avatar
Andrew Atkin
Posts: 36
Posted: 10.26.10, 02:08 AM
James you are totally wrong on this.

It is absolutely inconceivable how a calculator can experience itself - always will be. You need to visualise the simple reality of it. The is no way that we can look at an object processing information, and find ourselves saying to..."Aha! I see...if you connect that link to this link then of course it will lead to a conscious experience".

With consciousness you are dealing with something that is completely incomprehensible to us on any level. Again - the best (and only) thing we can do is identify the neurological correlations to subjective experience. And the only thing that will be proven is the correlation.

At base, understanding consciousness has nothing to do with maths. And highly abstract theories will only create the fantasy of understanding (for some). This is just the way it is - because of what it is.
jamestiberias Avatar
jamestiberias
Posts: 3
Posted: 06.03.10, 10:05 AM
The argument is circular: conciousness cannot be understood because conciousness cannot be understood. Also, "never" suggests the logical fallacy of personal incredulity. You have not proven your premises; your claim of "fact" is uncompelling.

It is a difficult problem. The solution may not be wholly intuitive, but more like quantum theory, where understanding comes from mathematics. Quantum theory provides highly precise predictive tools which allow deep and practical manipulations and engineering solutions. And yet the engineers claim that intuitively it is still baffling.

A strong theory of conciousness will allow the building of conscious machines and possibly the analysis of consciousness in living creatures. Regardless of intuition, at that point I would regard it as practically understood.
Andrew Atkin Avatar
Andrew Atkin
Posts: 36
Posted: 05.26.10, 04:25 PM
It's not a style it's a fact.
marwell Avatar
marwell
Posts: 4
Posted: 05.26.10, 05:56 AM
@ aliens being dangerous to us (or not): When this man countered Hawkins' proposition to avoid the contact arguing that "all intelligence will be similar" and so he thinks aliens are safe, my jaw dropped.

Is this level of disconnect from reality displayed by presumably wise people even possible?

Was not Hitler's Germans' intelligence similar to "ours" or to "Jewish" intelligence?

Let's not reach for the archetypal devil. Let's look at what good people do.

Was not our intelligence similar to the intelligence of the native Americans? Did our similarity mean anything whatsoever to us, good natured Americans, to stop us from practically exterminating all of the local nations with their languages and culture because we wanted their land?

We don't know what other intelligence forms will do when they need our resources. But examples from our own history provide some insight into what can happen, what life does, mutual similarities aside.
marwell Avatar
marwell
Posts: 4
Posted: 05.26.10, 05:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew Atkin
The problem with consciousness is that it can never be understood.
People with this style of "deep thinking" made themselves a church and brought dark ages.
MountainView Avatar
MountainView
Posts: 3
Posted: 05.25.10, 12:31 PM
@Greg
I kind of agree with you, though this talk was about his book and the time he spent in the lab with these people.
I would also like them to go more in depth of the subject of memory and the brain.
Do you know of any other talks about this subject, more in depth and or about new discoveries in the field of neuroscience?
Andrew Atkin Avatar
Andrew Atkin
Posts: 36
Posted: 05.22.10, 01:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Pugh
I think it's obvious we'll eventually understand what makes someone conscious at the level of the brain.
Thanks for you reply, but I have to say "Good luck!" relating to the quote.

For sure, consciousness can be ever closer correlated to neurological processes (and I agree we should continue to penetrate as far as we can), but the existence of an [ultimately] purely mechanistic process that can understandably (to our cognition) generate a conscious reaction does not exist - that is, it's something that we can never understand because, for us, it is simply inherently incomprehensible.

It's hard for me to prove my point beyond that statement, but this is one thing that I am confident we can truly say 'never' to. To say; the other great 'never' is the question of how and why anything could exist at all - we'll never understand that one too.
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