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Richard Epstein: Breaking Down Healthcare Reform

Columbia Law School
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khalsa Avatar
khalsa
Posts: 1
Posted: 09.23.09, 04:23 PM
Arrogant know-it-all. Repeat the mantra "Free market is the only way". Of course most of the people who follow this same mantra aren't willing to put a price on a life like this guy. He says the public option will kill all insurance. I agree, so what? He argues that government run healthcare has it's place like schip, well if SCHIP is so great then why not have it for everybody? I.E. Single-payer. Of course if you don't like universal healthcare there is another free market approach which he doesn't address. Get rid of the insurance companies and have patients directly paying doctors. Why not discuss this, it seems like the real free-market choice? How can "consumers" (I prefer people) make good health decisions, when they know that their only option is to pay a for-profit company who's only path to profit is by denying them care for their health? This sounds like communism to me.
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Linux Avatar
Linux
Posts: 9
Posted: 09.23.09, 10:49 PM
this man is a conservative nutjob, conservatives have no sense of logic or reason.
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Edward85 Avatar
Edward85
Posts: 1
Posted: 09.28.09, 04:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by khalsa
Arrogant know-it-all.
As opposed to your humble ignorance?

Quote:
Originally Posted by khalsa
Repeat the mantra "Free market is the only way".
Except at the end when he specifically said that it was not applicable vis-à-vis children, but your mantra of reducing his every argument to a supposed mantra rather then debate them is really all we can expect, can we?

Quote:
Originally Posted by khalsa
Of course most of the people who follow this same mantra aren't willing to put a price on a life like this guy.
Indeed, he makes the point that resources aren't unlimited and that the concept of opportunity-cost is such that a utilitarian-calculus of rationing must occur under the logic of single-payer. But remember that he isn't for single-payer. It's not that he is comfortable with putting a price on life, but that he is explaining that single payer requires putting a price on life. The moral question is really for you, since you appear to be for it - do you understand that this is a corollary of what you want, and are you comfortable with it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by khalsa
He says the public option will kill all insurance. I agree, so what?
He explains "so what" for the entirety of the lecture. Being humble, I suppose?

Quote:
Originally Posted by khalsa
He argues that government run healthcare has it's place like schip, well if SCHIP is so great then why not have it for everybody? I.E. Single-payer.
Again, he explains the difference towards the end.

Quote:
Originally Posted by khalsa
Of course if you don't like universal healthcare there is another free market approach which he doesn't address. Get rid of the insurance companies and have patients directly paying doctors. Why not discuss this, it seems like the real free-market choice?
How is taking an entire set of companies and "getting rid of them" (nice euphemism), and forcing people to deal with their doctor in a particular fashion by decree a "free-market choice"? You're obviously very confused. How very modest of you.

I'll have to cut the next part up and deal with it in parts, because it's loaded to the hilt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by khalsa
How can "consumers" (I prefer people)
It is the people who consume. Runners are people who run. See how this works?

Quote:
Originally Posted by khalsa
make good health decisions
It's called the sanctity of contract. You can make good decisions because you know that your agreements are enforced by the law.

Quote:
Originally Posted by khalsa
, when they know that their only option is to pay a for-profit company
How do you make good hair-cut decisions when you know that your barber just wants to make profit? How do you make good eating decisions when you know that your grocer just wants to make profits?

Quote:
Originally Posted by khalsa
who's only path to profit is by denying them care for their health?
Does your barber's only path to profit consist of giving you a quick and bad hair-cut so he has more time for more customers? (woops, I mean people. Didn't mean to be insensitive or something). Does your grocer make more profits by selling your rotten fruit he got at a huge discount? Think about this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by khalsa
This sounds like communism to me.
Communism is a state of anarchy in which there are no property rights. Socialism is when the state runs and owns everything. Fascism or corporatism is when the state doesn't own everything de jure but effectively controls it de facto through laws and edicts.

Here's the fun part: guess which category you fall into. And don't be humble about this - share it with us!
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DesDownUnder Avatar
DesDownUnder
Posts: 5
Posted: 09.28.09, 01:58 PM
It's fairly obvious that the speaker puts bean counting ahead of compassion. Set aside what can and cannot be done within the constraints of finance and medical science, and it becomes obvious that unregulated Capitalism is when someone profits at another's expense without any regard for the predicament that the profiteering creates for people.
In this regard Capitalism is the perfect cover for the brutish, the bullying, the fascist mentality, even if it has learned to smile and sound like it is making a plausible argument.
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intolerantape Avatar
intolerantape
Posts: 1
Posted: 09.28.09, 03:01 PM
Very enlightening lecture.
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Warner Todd Huston Avatar
Warner Todd Huston
Posts: 1
Posted: 10.05.09, 12:15 AM
Epstein is exactly right here. Obamacare is a sham. This was an excellent lecture.
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John P T Avatar
John P T
Posts: 1
Posted: 10.06.09, 07:01 AM
Love it!

Side note: Insanely fast download. I got 8 megabits per second speed.

About the video: I agree with the lecturer. He challenges those who think they can offer better health care options to PROVE it and enter the arena of the free market.

The government, this Obama regime, seems to boldly claim they can do better to 'service' the people but they lack any proof to evince that claim! Coverage to more people- maybe; quality of service actually delivered- less then current level with greater costs (tax payers foot the bill). Coverage does not equal benefits and innovation delivered.

The Obama crew just wants to bully others into accepting their rule and their terms for a selfish big government power grab.

Capitalism is not always smooth nor kind and gentle buts its mechanism does offer IMPROVEMENT of a system over time by free market challenges to be met. Having big government do it all is tantamount to asking for stagnation.

As Obamacare stands it takes all the flaws of the healthcare insurance system and just dumps them onto the tax payers (to say nothing of all the other Socialist angles in that monster sized proposal) without offering advancement of the system.

Tom Carper (D-Del.) said he will not read the Obamacare bill in full before he votes YES to pass it! He is on the Finance Committee! He says its too big and complicated and he aided in making parts of it! What does that tell you of the merit of the bill? It says it bloated and useless.

Do where is the free market counter (competitor's move to make profits, innovate and gain market share from the rival by exploiting the rival's errors in making the offering too complicated) action in this case? Only in the free market... If big bureaucracy (kleptocracy it seems!) steps in we are just left with Thomas Carper (D-Del.) and other's too big, too flaw and too complicated 'choice' of healthcare.

Obama lied and said this (Obamacare) gives citizens more options and choices. He in fact proposes to give LESS in the way of meaningful choices and options... This lecture explains the core basis why it is so.

Nice video! I dig it! 8-)
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BobbyAl Avatar
BobbyAl
Posts: 1
Posted: 10.11.09, 10:18 PM
This is an excellent lecture and much better than anything I've seen in the media. The line about being "free to tell the truth because I'm not running for anything" pretty well sums it up. The Republican response to the proposed legislation of the Democrats is a long way from the truth, which is that both Medicaid and Medicare have been disastrous for the healthcare system. No politician can advocate their repeal and we end up instead with leaders trying to fix the problem with more of the same. This does not bode well for our democracy.
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AminCad Avatar
AminCad
Posts: 1
Posted: 10.21.09, 12:22 AM
Excellent talk. Unfortunately too many people think that by surrendering power to government, more problems get solved, when the exact opposite is true.

I think an entire generation has been indoctrinated to hate free markets.
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ajstavely711 Avatar
ajstavely711
Posts: 21
Posted: 11.22.09, 06:31 AM
Free Markets are wonderful! BUT NOT WHEN IT COMES TO HEALTH CARE OR OUR CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM, PERIOD! Cover everyone with a basic Medicare type policy and let the free market sell supplementary plans to those who want them...There would be a huge market and everyone would have basic coverage.



Stop privatizing prisons!
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