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A REALLY Inconvenient Truth: Dan Miller

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DannyAstro Avatar
DannyAstro
Posts: 21
Posted: 09.18.09, 11:09 PM
To Cosmic Ray: As mentioned in the talk, temperature and C02 track each other. It's true for the ice age cycles that temperature changes (caused by slight changes in the Earth's orbit) lead changes in CO2. But the resulting CO2 changes caused more temperature changes that caused more CO2 changes and that's why the ice age temperature swings were much larger than the temperature changes directly due to the orbital changes. In the current situation, mankind's release of CO2 lead the changes in temperature, but the increased temperatures are feeding back to cause more releases of greenhouse gases which will cause more temperature increases. And since we started this in the already warm part of the cycle, we are moving up into uncharted (at least for millions of years) territory and into an environment where man and most living things are not well adapted.
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deltapeco Avatar
deltapeco
Posts: 4
Posted: 09.18.09, 10:07 PM
the earth is subject to cycles.. I am not convinced that humans have caused global warming but we are pushing it along at a faster rate
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deltapeco Avatar
deltapeco
Posts: 4
Posted: 09.18.09, 10:04 PM
My girlfriend hates it when I talk about this stuff. She doesn't want to know,,,,,I think that is why it is going to happen only a small fraction of us get it it and know what needs to be done. the rest are just sticking there heads in the sand and don't want to here about it they just want the latest iPhone very sad
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Cosmic Ray Avatar
Cosmic Ray
Posts: 2
Posted: 09.18.09, 04:19 PM
In section 3, "the relationship of temperature to CO2" the narrator makes a big mistake. He implies that CO2 drove those temperature changes in that ice core graph. In reality, the temperature changed hundreds of years before the CO2 changed. This is a fact and it's even discussed on realclimate.org.

CR
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kenny Avatar
kenny
Posts: 35
Posted: 09.14.09, 11:17 PM
This is yet another con from the warmers. Unadulterated nonsense. C02 has nothing to do with the slight warming since the end of the Little Ice Age. These people are extracting the urine and preying on our propensity to need something to fear.
The truth of climate change is too inconvenient for these people. Besides the many thousands of scientists who refute the IPCC's agenda, one needs only understand how often they have published known falsehoods and discredited science to know the truth is not an issue for them. Gore even justified lying and exageration as necessary to promote their aims.....in other words, we're too dumb to make decisions on honest information. We can barely forecast the climate for next week yet most seem happy to believe these incredible claims for the next 100 years....it'd be funny if it wasn't going to cost millions of lives in parts of the earth and the ruination of many economies.
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DannyAstro Avatar
DannyAstro
Posts: 21
Posted: 09.12.09, 02:02 PM
bpecar: Watch the movie An Inconvenient Truth for an explanation of how ice cores are used to measure CO2 and temperature back 650,000 years (they analyze air bubbles trapped in the ice). There are cycles every ~100,000 years due to changes in the earth's orbit. Right now, we should be cooling off! We already were at the warm part of the cycle (that's why we're not in an ice age right now) and we're heading up -- way up -- from there.

Putting mirrors in space is one one the geo-engineering proposals. It's like putting smoke in the atmosphere, but more expensive. People have been putting huge white plastic sheets in the Alps recently to try to stop the glaciers from melting. That will only slow the process.

Dan
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bpecar Avatar
bpecar
Posts: 1
Posted: 09.12.09, 01:01 PM
I would like to know where you get numbers from 65000 years ago? I highly doubt you were around, or anyone else from your group. But assuming your data is FACT, then it looks like the earth runs in cycles, temps go up and down and up and down, and it looks like we are on the up, all part of the cycle. Maybe with all the ice melting we could just put up big mirrors all over the planet, would that help?
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4TimesAYear Avatar
4TimesAYear
Posts: 45
Posted: 09.12.09, 03:01 AM
In regards to geoengineering and the sulfates: about 30 years ago they started cap and trade on sulfur emissions. The "global warming" has been going on for 30 years. He just proved that tinkering with the environment caused global warming.
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AnaPaulina Avatar
AnaPaulina
Posts: 5
Posted: 09.12.09, 12:10 AM
Awareness
Remaining attentive to the current changes in our surrounding environment is of the upmost importance.
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mr_svperstar Avatar
mr_svperstar
Posts: 22
Posted: 09.11.09, 08:53 PM
I'm very pleased to see the "how to make a difference" slide said to buy "a more fuel efficient car", as opposed to most people that simply say "buy a hybrid".

Toyota's press release claim a Prius provides a 35% reduction in CO2 production over the life of a vehicle, and that it repays the energy debt of construction within 20,000km.

This is repeated on the news, in documentaries and throughout the media, BUT... this contains a great deal of false data and the reality is the tipping point is around 175,000km, meaning depending on usage it will be up of down 1 or 2%, which is virtually neglegible.

Lie #1 - Hybrids use less than half the fuel. It is a 20-30% saving at best, when compared to a true equivalent new car with modern fuel saving techniques. And if you downsize you can actually come out ahead of a hybrid. (if downsizing my claim above of 175,000km never eventuates, it starts in debt and only gets worse, and this is the actual alternative being overlooked by eco-minded motorists, not the claim of a similar sized vehicle)

Lie #2 - CO2 in production is partially offset by solar panels. I'm sure that isn't a lie in itself, but it is completely independant to the hybrid system. It's false data to make a misleading claim that earns Toyota and their customers tax payer hand outs. We should be upset by this.
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